E117 - Gauri Seshadri Leadership and Confidence

You can be great at your job and still get overlooked for one brutal reason: you don’t say the thing you’re thinking. I sit down with Gauri Seshadri, First Vice President of Toastmasters International, to talk about the hidden cost of hesitation and how practicing communication in a safe, structured environment changes the way you show up at work, in leadership, and in everyday conversations. Gauri shares a personal path from engineering and client calls to global volunteer leadership, and what it really takes to commit to roles that demand influence, clarity, and courage.

We also go deep on the new reality of workplace communication: it’s less about “communication skills” in general and more about cross-cultural communication across contexts. Direct vs indirect styles, time zones, expectations, and unspoken norms can turn a clear message into a misunderstanding fast. Add four generations in the same organization, and leaders have to learn a new playbook for motivating people, explaining the why, and supporting work-life balance and healthy rhythms without losing performance.

Along the way, we dig into perfectionism, imposter feelings, and the moment when “my voice matters” stops being a quote and becomes a responsibility. Gauri explains how to take action before you feel ready, how to create safe and courageous spaces where people speak up, and why legacy is built through people, not titles. You’ll also hear a powerful transformation story of a member who struggled with English and a stammer, kept showing up anyway, and eventually performed stand-up comedy internationally.

If you want stronger leadership development, public speaking confidence, and practical tools for global team communication, hit play now. Subscribe, share this with a friend who stays quiet in meetings, and leave a review. What’s one conversation you’re ready to take ownership of this week?

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Transcript

Welcome And The Communication Mission

SPEAKER_00 0:01

Welcome to the Uncommon Communicator Podcast. I am your host, James Gable, and this is where we bring enlightenment to the topic of communication. Are you ready to take ownership of your conversations? Are you looking to possess the skills to navigate and facilitate conversations to a mutual understanding? Then grab your growth mindset and let's go. Welcome to the Uncommon Communicator. It is today my pleasure to have with me Gai Shashadri, who is the first vice president of Toastmasters International. Go ahead and introduce yourself.

The Real Commitment Of Leadership

SPEAKER_02 0:31

Hello, everybody. Uh, I'm Gary Shishadri. Um, like James mentioned, I'm the first vice president of Toastmasters International. Sit on the global board of Toastmasters at the moment. I'm based in Bangalore, India. That's home now. That's where I'm logging in from today. But I actually started my career in the United States. I went to crack school there and began working in Denver, where James is from. Uh, I was an engineer working in air pollution, and a big part of my role involved working with clients across the country. And that's where, you know, I started noticing a gap. I would say I was completely fine doing the technical work. Uh, I was pretty good at it. But when it came to speaking with clients, especially people I did not know, uh, you know, people that I had to pick up the phone and talk to, but I had never met, I would really hesitate. I'd overthink, I'd hold myself back, and I could see that it was um starting to limit me quite a lot, right? As having the right answers in terms of air pollution didn't mean that people understood it because I don't speak it out loud. So around that time, I remember the senior from grad school mentioning Toastmasters. So I thought, you know, okay, let me give this a shot. And I joined a club in Denver with very much one mindset that I just need to get better at this one thing of speaking up. Uh, but I didn't just stay at that, it started changing how I showed up, uh, not just in presentations, not just in meetings, but in conversations and discussing ideas. I started becoming, I would say, more comfortable in putting my thoughts out there. And looking back, I think I joined for one reason, but I'm staying here today for a completely different one. So um the story continues, and I moved back home to India after being away for over a decade, and I found myself wanting something very familiar. Um, and for me, Toastmasters was that constant. When I moved back, I remember I think I moved back on an April 7th, and on April 10th, I attended my first Toastmasters meeting here uh in my country. Uh and I would say that's where the leadership part of my journey began. I started taking on leadership roles within the organization, uh, at the district level, at the international level. And over time that grew into serving on the global board today as first vice president. Um alongside that, you know, people think that I do Toastmasters for work. No, I don't. I still have to pay my bills and earn my money. So professionally, I work in game-based learning, which is a lot of fun. Uh, but if you look at where all of this started, it was really just recognizing that staying quiet was costing me more than I realized. And that's why I joined Toastmasters, started working on my communication. Uh, what I do in Toastmasters overlaps a lot with what I do at work professionally. Uh, it's given me a lot of opportunities, both personally and professionally. So that's my story in two minutes, and better I am today because of it.

SPEAKER_00 4:09

That's amazing. And that that's a lot similar to what others have shared in their journey into Toastmasters, which you've taken it all the way up to the board level, which I think uh maybe we can explain to the listeners what that means in the time commitment. Because I served as a district director, and you know, just as a minimum, that was a five-year commitment uh for me. And I skipped one of the roles, the division director, and you know, all the way up to first vice president. Uh, talk a little bit about that journey because it's a big commitment to your point, and thanks for clarifying that. This is not a paid position. And maybe, maybe talk about that journey and why you're doing it in a volunteer uh organization.

SPEAKER_02 4:50

Yeah, we often joke. I was at a board meeting just a week ago in Denver, uh, just got back home. Uh, and we were joking that, oh, yeah, with the amount of work we do, we should add a couple of extra zeros on our check, but there's no one in front of the zeros, unfortunately, right? Um leadership is serious business, whether it's in a volunteer organization or you know, in a for-profit. But at the same time, it's so satisfying. Um, you learn a lot. Uh, there's this quote from someone if you can empower volunteers and lead them, you know, make them do what you want, it's so much more easier in a for-profit or at your job with a paycheck out there. Uh, but yeah, um, so like you, I started at the district level, area division, um, then the district three year roles went on to serve as region advisor for two years. Uh, and the board is a seven-year commitment with the international director position and five years of EC. Uh but why I do it, because I learned so much at the end of it all. You know, every role that I've taken up, leadership-wise, I've picked up a new skill, I've grown as a result of it, and I've applied that skill uh at work as well. So I don't think anyone joins Toastmasters to become the best Toastmaster. I think everyone joins Toastmasters to take the skills outside and apply it to work to real life.

SPEAKER_00 6:25

Yeah, that's very true. And really, I think going in with the idea I want to improve my public speaking, or it's amazing how many go in just to actually they have a toast coming for a wedding or something. Oh not really knowing about the leadership portion of it. And that's the part that really got me first. I mean, I'm I'm looking forward to I'm uh I'm completing my immediate past district director, so still can't compete. You know, being able to go through the competition portion of Toastmasters, which I'm I'm guessing you have have you participated in any of the contests uh previously?

SPEAKER_02 6:57

You know, contests contests actually scare me, James. And I shouldn't be saying this after 20 years of being in Toastmasters, but there's something about being judged that terrifies me even today. Uh, and I hope not Toastmasters hearing this, because for all the Toastmasters, please do go and compete. Uh but uh once I got into leadership, I realized that it was no longer about a prepared five to seven minute speech, right? It was about uh convincing people, persuading them, uh making them see your point of view or you seeing their point of view and working towards the same goal. And that felt uh like so much real and things that I could actually take back to work. So I looked at it from how can I build myself, how can I build my career? Um, you know, those kind of things. Yeah. I hope but yeah, I I enjoy watching contests. I I'm a reluctant participant, but yeah, I've done my part.

Why Serve On The Global Board

SPEAKER_00 8:00

So I hope people do hear the whole uh thing about you know being. I mean, it it's still public speaking is one of the biggest fears that any human faces. I mean, it's it's arguably uh in there with death and spiders, and it's it's up there and it's a true and it's real. And I think it's important to note that, and I did our LinkedIn post recently just about how you know, I think it's 10% of all Toastmasters end up actually are in the competition, uh, which is a very small percentage that we put a lot of effort into during the contest season with the leadership because it is part of the mission and the vision, and because it promotes really um those aspects that get people out of their box, you know, get them out of their little area. And that's why it is it's something that never becomes easy. Uh, if it does, then you know tell us, you know, write the book. But uh learning how to channel it, learning how to uh you know perform better with it are all things that come with the practice. I always call it putting in the reps and uh all that is part of the program. But you went to the leadership side, which uh as I did as well, uh, of course, volunteering your time uh because you get so much more out of that than you do the five or seven minute speech. You know, there's plenty that are working on their key keynotes and uh looking to improve their, you know, their speaking on their on their jobs, but the leadership portion I think is missed in its ability to develop uh leaders at a high executive level because the training that you provided, like I've been, I think I've been in some of your trainings during the uh during the mid-years and during uh the you know the train the uh because we they train the district leaders. And I've said before, this is this is my call to leadership to people, is that you know, you're getting a I I make a number up, you're getting a$50,000, you know, executive level training through the course of even just to the district level and being able to take that and apply that to your job. I'm currently a director of operations for a general contractor. I've not done that role before, but fully prepared for that because I was a district director, working budgets, uh, you know, managing a team, all of those skills are 100% translatable from the job that I'm in now to where I didn't I didn't skip a beat because of that leadership skill. Now you've taken it even further uh up into the board level. What drew you into the board specifically?

SPEAKER_02 10:28

Uh so at the executive level, um we help shape where the organization is going. We study trends, we say, okay, what's going to come to the table in terms of discussions? But at the same time, we are also aware of the constraints that we have, our budgets, which uh we're trying to improve since the pandemic hit us and a lot of organizations worldwide. See, uh, you know, we are aware that this is a volunteer organization, so we don't want to burn out our leaders, burn out our volunteers in any way, yet give them the best member experience possible. So, what's going on in the market, what do our members need, um, those kind of things that we are talking about. So it's not about, uh let me put it this way, as a district leader, I was probably solving the problems of today, uh, what was happening in the district. But as a board member, I'm looking at where should the organization or where would we like the organization to go in the next five years, next 10 years? You know, lead that path.

SPEAKER_00 11:34

You know what's really cool at that level because you are looking that far ahead, is looking at uh, you know, we got a lot of emerging leaders, a lot of new members that are a different generation that have been through different things and we've gone through what are some challenges you're seeing with the organization and also with the the younger generation to really develop their communication skills. What what's what's something that's maybe holding them back or uh is a challenge for their education?

SPEAKER_02 12:05

So, you know, what I've been noticing more and more, not just in Toastmasters, but at work also, because I'm into game-based learning, is uh that the challenge isn't really communication anymore. It's about communication across contexts, communication across cultures, right? Uh the world has become a much smaller place now. Everyone's working in a global firm, global teams. Uh, we are all connected to each other on the internet. You are right now in Denver, I'm in India, and we are speaking to each other. So uh when with people working in global teams all the time now, uh across countries, cultures, time zones, what works in one setting doesn't always land the same way somewhere else. And honestly, this is something that I see a lot in my work as well, because I work with the big three, big four firms uh out there, right? Uh with large consulting and corporate teams. And one of the most common asks from my company is they ask us for help with cross-cultural communication. Not because people don't have ideas, uh, that's rarely the issue. Everyone pretty much has an idea and perspective, but because the communication styles are very, very different. Uh, some people are more direct, some are more subtle, some are more reserved, and that gap can lead to misinterpretation. Uh I only a few years ago learned, and this was actually during a Toastmaster's board orientation, was it was brought to my attention the difference between direct and indirect communication, how the Western world is more of a direct communication, but we in Asia we tend to read between the lines more. So what you say to me, I'm like, did James really mean that? What did James really mean it? I probably would go into that kind of analysis out there, right? Um, our intents might be very same, but a very different impact because of the way how I'm interpreting whatever you are saying. Um, yeah. So uh there've been times, uh, this again from my own personal experience, when I felt I was being very clear, very assertive, very confident in my communication. But the feedback that I got, especially from my Western colleagues, was that I needed to be more confident, needed to be more assertive. And that kind of shocked me because if I push any further, it would feel very unnatural to me. And uh in my own country, it would start to feel like I was being rude or even a bit arrogant. Uh, I really can't talk that way, right? So I started to realize that communication isn't just about expressing yourself well, it's about being a lot more intentional about who you're speaking to, right? Know your audience and how it's likely to learn for them. Because today it's not enough for something to make sense to you, it has to make sense to the person on the other side, wherever they are, um, and most importantly, how they are seeing the world. And I think with the Gen Z, with the millennials, because uh the world's become much more smaller for them, that's one thing that they have to constantly be aware of.

SPEAKER_00 15:37

Yeah, that well, that's it, it's amazing how it goes across cultural lines, but also generational lines. Like the practice between going across international lines and generational lines is very similar. And that's really one of the tenets of the uncommon communicator. And one of the things that I look to do is really give a voice for people. But in addition to that, build skills that help people communicate. The uncommon communicator takes ownership of their conversations, which is right in line with anyone being a good communicator, knowing that communication is or isn't happening. But really, everything you talked about, having the skills to be able to adjust to each individual. We recently interviewed somebody from the Eastern bloc uh to join our organization and was very self-aware about how direct they are. And often that's something that's misinterpreted from him just culturally, that that he could be appeared rude. And he's I would consider that's probably considered West to you as well, too, right? Like I'm talking Europe, right? So even from Europe, Western is even more um uh upfront and blunt than than the United States. And knowing those things allows, you know, the I guess the offense to be kind of put aside and know that that's how they were taught. It's cultural, it's cultural understanding, I think, is really one of the most difficult things to navigate.

Generations At Work And Leadership Shifts

SPEAKER_02 17:04

Yeah, I just want to bring up something that you said two minutes ago. It's not just about boundaries, but it's a different culture across generations, also, right? I'm from Gen X, where it was do your work and try to find a little balance. Uh, but my parents' generation, it was about do the work and don't ask questions, you know, even if you have to do over time. Because it was all about job security. Today, when I worked with Gen Z and millennials, it's about work-life balance. In fact, I would say they put a lot more priority into having that quality of life than spending at work. They want to know the why they should work on something, why is it important? How is it they it's going to improve? Those questions kind of keep us honest, but it's a way that we have to learn to adapt to answer to as well. I no longer can say, just do it because I am your boss and I sit. So it doesn't work.

SPEAKER_00 18:02

The good old days are gone for us, aren't they? Well, and so like even working in an organization, a volunteer organization, and and that's one of the skills I think that is different than to what you exactly what you were talking about, same generation that I was raised in. Uh, it's you have to pres you have to present as a boss, as a leader, differently to motivate than than we were accustomed to in the past. So it's generational. But in addition, it's really been um it's been interesting to to watch the generation you you mentioned that work life balance as well, too. Well, within my organization, and and we are um so in tune with uh self-development. I mean, that's one of the reasons I joined them uh recently. But we talk about rhythms of life versus um uh work-life balance, just because we're you know, it's not you you have a little bit of work and then you go home and then you have your balance, right? It truly is during the day they welcome the fact that maybe you need to take a walk or maybe you need to go take care of the kids. And so having that type of rhythms of life is what the generation is looking for as well, too, not what we were accustomed to or I was accustomed to, which was going to work and then you worked until the sun went down and you went home and ate dinner and went to bed. So it's just it's different. And I I admire the generation for seeing that uh ability to be able to have that balance, but it does create a different um you know expectations as a leader, yes, uh, as well as communicating, you know, those things to say, we're we're we're saying it's okay to do these things.

SPEAKER_02 19:41

Yeah, it's it's tough in the corporate world because right now I was reading a study the other day.

SPEAKER_00 19:47

There are four generations working uh you know in an organization at any time, and to have the same voice speaking to all four and it landing differently is really, really well, and I would say that challenge, like going into uh the Toastmasters organization, looking at that, those same generations are in a volunteer organization of people who work to develop their skills. And so you have to meet still the needs of, and I have plenty of them in club uh that I'm a member of that are retired. They're doing it to give their time to the next generation, but they think differently in how the new generation wants to uh arrive and show up. And, you know, we're maybe not as technology advanced uh from the uh the retired generation to what the younger generation wants. These are the challenges I think that are happening in the workplace. They happen in the Toastmaster Club. That's why I think it's such a great way to really develop those skills uh for work. But it's not gonna happen, it's not gonna take very long before that tide shifts. And that younger generation, you know, much uh you you admitted to Gen X, so I get a I get to go in with that. Um, same as I. Uh that but that our generation was truly smaller than our parents' generation, and it's smaller than the generation right now. And so we're right in that middle, and they're about to take over, and we have to be prepared to uh let them lead and let them lead in the focus.

SPEAKER_02 21:20

There are often days that I catch myself when my sentences start, but back in my days, I have to bite my tongue on that out.

My Voice Matters And Why

SPEAKER_00 21:31

Oh man. Well, yeah, this is this has nothing to do with communication, but it does. I was on a project where I was uh I had two field engineers on my project and both of their ages added up didn't make mine. And that's when I realized uh that you know, there truly was a gap in there as well, too. And and it goes to communication as well, too. Like they obviously communicate differently than than I do. Uh those were two couple of superstar now superintendents, but um Being able to work with them and see how they operate was, you know, it goes back to that learning for ourselves as well. Well, one thing I'm gonna jump into this. Uh, you were quoted as as saying that Toastmasters has shown me that my voice matters. Tell me more about what brought you to that point.

SPEAKER_02 22:23

Um this line eventually came from a few different phases in my life, right? As an engineer, um, there were we've only about five girls in a class of 30. Um, so I was uh already a little more conscious of how I showed up and what I said. I was also the first girl in my family, my entire family, extended family as well, to move overseas for higher education. And that was not easy. So that was one of the first real times that I had to speak up, uh, trust my own decisions, and convince my family also to trust them. Because until then, mom and dad were making all the decisions for me. And here I was out of college saying I want to travel back in those days, seven C's to a place far, far away, right? And then when I started working in the United States, I was the first Indian hired by my company, first one on a work visa. So they had to learn to work with me, and I had to learn to work with them. And so I think in a lot of these spaces, I became more aware of myself. Uh, but that, you know, should I put it? What translated because of all that was a lot of hesitation. I often had something to say, an idea, a perspective, uh, but I wouldn't always say it. Uh, either because I wasn't fully sure, or I felt like I needed to be more confident before speaking because um, you know, I was the only one of my type in the room sometimes. Right. So, and over time I started noticing a pattern, James. You know, conversations would move forward, decisions would get made, and I would walk away from that room thinking, you know, I wish I should have said something there. Or if only I had said something. And that's really what brought me to Toastmasters in the first place, right? So, what changed over time was this that I stopped waiting to feel ready. Even now I get caught sometimes wanting to be perfect. Uh, and I think we were having this conversation last time when we spoke. Uh, but I started speaking even when I wasn't completely sure, and I realized I didn't have to be perfect to contribute, and that started to show up on how I took on responsibility as well. So at one point, uh, I was the first female district director of my home district, and whether you intend it or not, when you're in a position like that, what you say and what you don't say carries weight for all the people who are watching you.

SPEAKER_01 25:09

Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_02 25:10

You've been in that position before, and that just reinforced that same idea for me. So once you start using your voice, you realize that it's not just about you anymore and that your voice really, really matters. Yeah. So uh over the years, I've finally come to that realization.

SPEAKER_00 25:29

Yeah, that's really powerful, and that's something that and it took me a while to really find out that that truly is like what is my my mission? Uh and I went through a whole process. It's probably not uh maybe in a whole nother story for another time. But when I really realized what am I doing? Like, why am I committing my time to Toastmasters? Why am I so committed to communication? It's truly is about helping people find that voice. Because, you know, a lot of times just where I was raised and how I how I grew up, I didn't have some limitations or different expectations that uh others have, like being the only person in the room. But it is still that same uh, I guess the same thing that affects people inside happens across all uh culturals and generations. Um but you know, those are also things that are complicated. But if we can help people have that voice and really know that it matters, um, that's something that I think really will change our world. It'll change people's lives ultimately. When it comes down to it, I I'm not I'm not gonna be able to solve world hunger. Uh, but if I can solve one person who ables to have their uh voice and make it matter. So I think that's really cool. That's very powerful uh stuff that you've called.

SPEAKER_02 26:44

I'm gonna confess to something very personal out here, James. Um, so when I first joined the board as an international director, that's the first part of the board. The first few months I was a little more quieter because it's a global board. I was from India, though, of course, I'd been in the US, but I had moved back home and it had been a long time. And on the board, we have people from different countries out there, not just the United States and India, right? And I remember an EC mentor coming to me, an executive committee mentor for those who don't understand what EC is. Uh, one of the poem mentors coming to me and saying, uh, Gary, um the your people voted you to be their voice and not their ears. So start speaking up. And uh yes, that that landed pretty pumpfully with me. I I don't just blabber on the board, but when I have something to say, uh I do make it a point to say it.

SPEAKER_00 27:44

Wow, that is what what a great leader to do that.

SPEAKER_02 27:47

Yeah, amazing.

Take Action Before You’re Ready

SPEAKER_00 27:48

And also have an opportunity to have that voice, right? Like you're it's not like you're in an organization that doesn't allow you, it's allowing you to have the voice and encouraging you to have that. Um, I joined a new company, you know, recently this year, and I sit on their executive team, and I feel that same type of openness. I mean, they they started the company, they've been here 14 years, you know, long before I came there. But there is that openness, and not all organizations even promote that. And that's one of the reasons that I really want to help people uh have a voice. Thanks for sharing that, because that's uh that's powerful for anybody in another organization to hear that, to be able to support other leaders to do the same. I uh we can't skip past this because you already brought it up. But uh you talked about uh taking action before anything is planned. That one really connects with me as well, too. Uh, before it's not perfect. We use the word uh excellence, like instead of perfection, we we shoot for excellence. But um you so you advocate for taking action before everything is planned. It doesn't sound like that has always been uh how you operated. Do you want to tell a little bit about what got you to that point?

SPEAKER_02 29:05

Uh for me, like you said, that's something that's evolved over time. Even now I have to catch myself because I do hesitate to step in. Um, there's a line I really liked from Cheryl Sandberg, uh, who said, you know, if someone offers you a seat on a rocket ship, you don't ask what seat, you just get on and then figure it out. And I think that's what uh kind of captures how often we wait to feel ready. Sometimes we tell ourselves, you know, I'll take this role when I have all the skills, I'll speak up when I'm more confident, I'll step into something once I'm fully prepared. Uh but in my experience, that point of feeling ready doesn't really arrive, you know, the way that we expect it to. It's not like, aha, this is your perfect moment. Now you can step into what you want. Because that's when you probably don't have the opportunity knocking uh on your door anymore. Right. Uh earlier I would ask myself, do I have everything it takes to do this? Now I have started asking myself uh something very different. You know, what can I learn from this? How will this help me grow? Uh, in some ways, I'm actually curious to see how I'll shape up uh by stepping into something before I feel completely ready. Is it uncomfortable? Honestly, very, very uncomfortable. But it's it's also very exciting because a lot of that clarity only comes once you're actually in it. You try something, you learn, you adjust, and then the next step becomes clearer, right? It is one step at a time. So for me, uh it's less about having everything figured out before you begin and more about trusting that you will grow into it once you start.

SPEAKER_00 30:58

So Yeah, I think there's a saying that talks about like growth, you know, it only happens in those uncomfortable zones. You know, if we stay comfortable, we're never gonna grow. That's one of the things. Uh, are you familiar with Enneagram as a uh um it's really like a personality assessment? The the Enneagram, just really quickly, there's like nine um like roles that you would fit into. It's very much like disc, it's very much like a lot of the other programs. It just breaks it down a little bit further and they allow you to have these wings, and it's just a little different uh take on personalities, but they all come into alignment. I'm a one, which is a perfectionist, and I call myself a recovering perfectionist because I truly have been able to move out of some of the things that have kind of frozen me to not act. And I think Toastmasters has a lot to do, and I'm gonna just go straight into you know, like table topics, like going out there and be able to talk about a topic that is, you know, you don't know what it is, and and to go out there and um you know experience that type of uncomfortableness translates well into like not having to be you know perfect at everything. And so that's a really important thing that you bring up in regards to that because opportunities sometimes only happen at you know right then. And I I I've been the uh I've been really good at um uh holding regrets, like thinking about those things that I could have done. So when you realize that you really want to move faster now because you know that it's gonna be okay, you know, you know it's not gonna turn into some kind of you know disaster because you've you've navigated a little bit of that. Did Toastmasters help you um work through that, or were you already on kind of a self-journey of no, no, it's it's all thanks to only Toastmasters in real life.

SPEAKER_02 32:47

One wrong step, and it would cost me quite a lot of money, it would cost me working opportunities and visas. But Toastmasters allowed me to experiment, it was a safe space for me. Uh, it's a place where you can actually fail and then learn from it and then go and apply it in real work. I like I said, you know, my journey, I started as an environmental engineer. And if I hadn't gotten the confidence, I wouldn't have shifted career paths so many times before I landed to where I am right now. I probably wouldn't even have moved back home because I was well on the path of getting a green card and all that stuff. Yeah, but I was like, I I want to meet people, I want to interact with them. So I did I love air pollution? I loved it. I thought that was my calling at that point of time. Uh, do I love what I'm doing now? I think it's perfect. I think it's my calling right now. So there were lots of things that uh I experimented with in Toastmasters before I just got to this point. Yeah, um, and I think I'm still experimenting. I remember when I was being interviewed uh for the executive committee for the board a year ago, actually two years ago, um I gave them all the Toastmasters answers, uh, but then they said what else? And I said, you know, one of my whys why I want to commit for another five years is I want to see what sort of gallery comes out of, you know, after five years. I want I'm excited to meet the gallery I become out of them. So yeah.

Creating Safe Spaces That Empower Others

SPEAKER_00 34:22

Oh, that might be our quote uh of the day. Yeah, truly having the uh ability to navigate those kind of things, I think, is a skill set that uh I know I didn't have uh throughout my life. Like I missed opportunities, I missed things to be able to um uh take those risks. And you know, at my age now, I I look back and those are things I wish I had I had learned earlier, and so I'm doing more of that now. Uh and and I'm happier. That's the weirdest thing about that. The thing that you think is gonna make you unhappy by doing actually makes and brings more satisfaction. That's the craziest part. And if we just share that, I think that's gonna be um you know really, really important. Uh so yeah, I applaud you for doing that and for taking those type of actions uh and uh and sharing that as well, too. Uh, one other question I wanted to ask too is you also mentioned that you focus on using your voice to create meaningful change and empower others to build confidence. Tell tell us a little bit about how you've done that both inside of Toastmasters, and I know that you've done this outside of Toastmasters as well, because it's that rhythm, right? It fits both life and uh the life of Toastmasters.

SPEAKER_02 35:41

All right. Uh so I think for me, uh using your voice has never just been about speaking about more, it's more about what it allows for other people, right? So inside of Toastmasters, I've seen it in really simple ways. Sometimes they're just helping, you know, mentoring someone and helping them get through their first few speeches or giving feedback and seeing something in them really shift. Um, and over time you start to see that shift in them as well. They go from holding back to actually wanting to speak up, right? So when I was a region advisor, uh, which is basically supervising Toastmasters operations in a region, um, in my case, about 12 to 20 countries, uh, you know, the people that I've worked with, the leaders I've worked with, I now serve on the board with them. So I've seen them grow. I've you know, I've been part of their journey just a little bit, uh, help them navigate. And I'm not saying that I'm the only reason, but I'm glad to have been 1% of the reason that, you know, in their growth journeys. Uh outside of Toastmasters, it shows up in pretty similar ways, just in a very different setting. So in my work, a big part of what I do is creating space or creating safe and courageous spaces where people feel comfortable sharing ideas, asking questions, or even disagreeing, especially in environments where they might otherwise hold back. So today most of the global firms have what we call a flat hierarchy. Everyone calls each other by the first names. And we advocate that in India as well. But our culture uh is so inherent in us, uh, because as growing up, someone who's senior to you, someone who's elder than you, uh, you know, you have to call them sir or ma'am. So if you join a Toastmasters meeting out here, you will have people saying, James, sir, how are you doing? That's how they will address you. Uh so while we might be saying that this is a flat hierarchy, it's not truly a flat hierarchy uh back home sometimes because of the culture, right? So creating that space where they people can speak up, where they feel comfortable sharing that idea, you know, is a big part of what I do. Like I mentioned, and once that space exists, uh something really interesting starts to happen. You don't really have to push people to speak anymore, they start doing it on their own. And so for me, it's less about giving someone a voice, it's more about creating conditions where they feel comfortable using the one that they already have, right? So when people kind of go back, go from holding back to choosing to speak up, that for me is uh empowering them and empowering their voices.

SPEAKER_00 38:42

Yeah, that's gotta be really fulfilling to see people that you worked with years below stepping into kind of higher levels of leadership. That's gotta really warm warm your heart.

SPEAKER_02 38:53

Yeah. I remember, and this is sorry, folks, this is a few Toastmaster example. I remember attending a district officer's training program once as region advisor, and it was my own home district. And the division director, I was watching the previous sessions, and the one of the area directors, I think, um, said, Why do I have to work this hard? What is my legacy going to be? Are you going to build a statue for me? Sort of thing, if I become distinguished, right? And the next session was mine. So I picked up that question and I said, I think the legacy are the people that you see uh, you know, you've been a part of. To see someone who worked with me as an area director now become the district director and lead the district, that is my legacy in some ways, right? Uh, so the legacy are people. You can't uh know a statue would be nice. I would love a statue. Really? That's good to know. But I probably would have crows sitting on top of that as well. Uh, but but I think it's the people around you that create your legacy and yeah, well, that's truly is like that's the impact that we leave, right?

From Stammer To Stand Up Comedy

SPEAKER_00 40:10

I love the word legacy as well, too, because when you have an ability to impact people's lives like you do, like uh leaders do in Toastmasters, and really at every club level being able to have those relationships to know that somebody's gonna step from who they were when they stepped into the club to within a short period of time being uh sometimes a completely different person. Do you have like a specific moment or an individual, you don't have to mention their name, where you saw that type of transformation from really coming from a knowledge from a space of not knowing anything to really transforming their lives?

SPEAKER_02 40:50

Uh lots of stories, but there's one story that I really love to say, and it's really stayed with me. There was a member in one of our clubs out here in India who joined with a couple of challenges. Uh, he wasn't very confident speaking in English because English is not really our first language, so he would always think twice, uh, struggle for the right words. He also had a bit of a stammer, so that made it more awkward for him. So him getting getting him to speak itself was a very big step, uh, right? But he stayed with the program, he kept showing up, uh, he was very open to learning, he worked with his mentors and put himself in those situations again and again. And here there was someone who didn't speak very good English, stammered, yet kept applying for contests, speech contests over and over again, right? Uh, the change wasn't dramatic, it wasn't overnight, it was gradual. Uh, but you could soon see him becoming more and more comfortable, less focused on getting every word right, and more focused on expressing what he wanted to say, that message. And at some point there was a shift. It stopped being about fluency, became more about confidence, more about connection. He went on to win our district humorous speech championship, and from there it really took off. Uh, today he's performing stand-up comedy across the country and internationally as well, right? Uh, so he's really found fame and fortune, and what stood out to me was nothing about him became perfect, and I but at some point it stopped holding him back. He just went, embraced his imperfection, and he embraced it so confidently. And he's made a name for himself out there.

Introversion Misread And The One Takeaway

SPEAKER_00 42:45

Wow, that's I like I like your your words, embrace the imperfection. Because in reality, that's everybody is imperfect. We we get this picture that they they do something perfectly, and there's something in their own life. Nobody likes like anybody with curly hair wants straight hair. Everybody with straight hair wants curly hair. And in reality, I don't know, just shave your head. Let's let's make it even for everybody. But that that's something that really is empowered somebody to a career uh and fame just from embracing what they had and and improving their ability to communicate. That's a brilliant story. That's uh that's a great story to share. I've got two more questions and then we'll kind of wrap things up. Uh, the first question is uh, what what is one thing that you think people get wrong about you?

SPEAKER_02 43:37

Uh that I think where I'm often misunderstood is because I'm an introvert, uh, I don't like come into the room and I'm like, hello, people here, Riskari. And that's why they may feel like I'm a little bit aloof uh or I hide behind my position quite a lot. Uh the truth of the matter is people actually strangers actually scare me a little bit. I have social phobia. So when you see me at the District 26 conference and if I'm not speaking with you, uh please come and say hello. I just need a starting someone to start the conversation and then it'll be difficult for me to stop. So I often get that that I'm not connecting. It's not that I don't want to connect. I just you know don't feel confident enough to connect and make that start.

Closing Thanks And How To Connect

SPEAKER_00 44:29

Yeah I appreciate you sharing that. And that's I think true for a lot of people uh and and to understand that as a communicator knowing you know you can't always take that first read right you have to make a connection and and see that. And then the final wrap up question this is something I always do on our podcast is you know I know that people have been listening for 40 minutes. Like what are they going to walk away with? Are they going to remember 40 minutes of this incredible information we've been handing them maybe uh but what is one thing that you think is the you see moment I call it the uncommon communicator moment where that somebody can walk away going I'm gonna leave with this and apply this uh today what do you think would will come from the today's conversation uh if I just want if I can wrap up the whole conversation and just one single sentence I would say this you don't have to be fully ready or confident to add value. Sometimes you just need to speak up I love it that's that's mic drop wow well thanks so much Gary I appreciate your time I appreciate uh working through time zones with me as well this has been a brilliant conversation I think some great nuggets that we're walking away with and uh I appreciate you coming on so uh thanks so much and that's all we've got see you bye thank you so much see you every month congratulations you made it all the way to the end you're officially a one percenter thanks for tuning in to this episode of the Uncommon Communicator with me your host James Gable make sure you like and share this episode this helps spread the message of communication to the world check out our website the Uncommon Communicator for more and connect with me on LinkedIn to keep building those communication skills. See you next time